There are groups of gun enthusiasts that love to appendix carry while another group of shooters thinks its a safety hazard. This group thinks an accidental discharge can occur while you’re drawing the pistol as the line of sight is toward the pelvic area.
Rob Leatham and Rob Pincus goes over some advantages that appendix carry offers such as concealment, speed, and presentation of the weapon.
Rob Pincus explains one advantage that appendix carry shine is keeping your weapon in front while drawing and displaying. Where as the side holstered there is more required motion with your arms to get the handgun un-holstered and on target. With appendix carry positioned its very easy to go to your weapon and puts your body in a ready to fight posture.
With the right technique mastered even a pudgy person can use the appendix carry effectively. See the footage below to get the idea.
Leatham: You know Rob, I carry an XDX 3.3 in an appendix holster all the time, but you can’t get around the fact that there’s a lot of people talking about the safety of them and stuff; and I feel comfortable with it, but you know I really wonder what your thoughts are.”
Pincus: Yeah, it’s definitely something that’s caused a lot of controversy and a lot of buzz. I think that frankly, carrying and presenting from the appendix position, and re-holstering a lot on the training range, if you’re doing it right, can actually be safer and give you less exposure to covering yourself with the muzzle, then 3 O’clock, 4 O’clock, 5 O’clock. You know we’ve all been on the range, and we’ve seen that guy who brings the gun back from its shooting position and points it right in through his whole pelvic girdle, through his torso, to get it back into the holster. And with appendix carry, we don’t have that. The gun starts out in front of our body, and we can keep it in front of our body, if we think about the angles involved.
Leatham: One of the best things about Appendix is that it doesn’t create a width for
Leatham: So this is a real problem, you know, you skinny guys don’t necessarily see it, but I take up a lot more space than you do, and any time I’m having to work around here, especially in a seated position, it just doesn’t work for me-
Leatham: At all! And the fact is, if I point a gun at me, that’s my fault, that’s on me. If I point a gun at everybody else, I have a real problem with that.
Pincus: Absolutely. You know, a lot of guys, because they don’t want to cover themselves, will flag that gun way out to the side, and obviously pose a danger in the training environment, but really end up with a reckless swing of the gun, instead of a presentation of the gun.
Leatham: And that’s a draw, too! That’s a really bad presentation of the gun.
Pincus: It is! Sets you up for a really bad position here because you don’t get that bio-mechanical lock. So let’s take a look at what’s going to happen. If we’re here talking and some guy comes up from around the corner, jumps out, startles us, maybe fires a shot, we’re both gonna go into that athletic, lower center of gravity, orient towards the threat, and this is what everybody sees. They see that gun in appendix carry -and I’m just going to go ahead and tuck in here behind my XDS, when I do this, now that gun is pointed into my body. So what I need to remember is, just like I’m going to remove my concealment garment, there’s other things involved in presentation from the holster, I’m gonna learn that as I reach for the gun, I push my hip forward. By pushing my hip forward, as soon as this gun comes out of the holster, that muzzle’s already pointed out in front of me, I orient the muzzle straight to the threat, I tuck back in so I have my body engaged behind the gun as I drive out and get into my shooting position. Then I can bring the gun back in, I obviously have dealt with that situation, I’ve assessed my environment, I’ve topped my gun off, I’ve got into cover, whatever I have to do, when I go to reholster, and obviously in the training environment, I’m just going to reverse that process. I’m not gonna be in my lowered center of gravity position, I’m gonna push my hips back forward, orient my gun back down just like this, the gun never covers my body, stays out in front of my body between my feet or in front of my toes, and then I can relax. And that just can’t be done from behind the body, and if you watch everybody on the range, I promise you, you see them cover that outside the leg and the foot.
People say that ‘well, if I get a round on the outside of my foot, that’s a lot better than taking a round into my pelvic girdle.’ How about we don’t point the gun at ourselves, like we’ve always preached?
Leatham: Right, and not shoot ourselves.
Leatham: That’s usually the best.
Pincus: So how ’bout this, I’m gonna let you jump up here in front of the target-
Pincus: and I’ll just step out of the way. And go ahead and just think about that position you’re gonna get into, that lowered center of gravity kind of crouch position. Now as you reach down to get that concealment garment out of the way, you’re just gonna push your hip forward.
Leatham: Ooh. I get it, so I’m basically pushing the gun forward.
Pincus: Pushing the gun forward. Also makes that grip more accessible.
Leatham: Yeah! It actually clears my stomach out of the way.
Pincus: Well as a scrawny guy I don’t have that issue!
Leatham: For you skinny guys it’s not a factor, but for us pudgy guys, that’s always a deal, I’ll have to work around that.
Pincus: Now you come straight out of the holster, the muzzle’s going to be in front of you, you make that rotation, and then you drive out, you take your shots, you come back in, you do whatever you need to do for the aftermath, and reverse the process, hip forward, back into the holster, and relax.
And that’s how you present from the Appendix carry very safely, and in a way that allows you to get a lot of reps without really worrying about covering yourself in a way, that doesn’t happen when you come from behind the hip.
Leatham: Right. Perfect.
This is one tactical shooting drill that you probably have never seen, but it certainly brings up an interesting topic on realism in training and the engagement of moving targets.
Rob Pincus came up with this shooting drill called “Dynamic Deviation Control“. Dynamic Deviation Control is a pistol shooting drill that is designed to inculcate a shooter to engage a moving target. This is just fancy talk for saying shooting while your gun is in motion.
Keeping you gun perfectly still during precision drills on the range is one thing, but do it while in motion will be a common occurrence during a defensive event. This may be a missing key element in your shooting regimen for personal defense.
This type of drill takes your paper target shooting up to the next level.
When you consider the bulk of tactical pistol training occurs on non-moving paper targets this drill makes a lot sense. Certainly worth trying out next time you are at the range, just be careful not to drop the basic principles such as grip, stance and sight alignment when you add movement to your gun.
Sources: Rob Pincus, Rob Leatham, Andy Van Loan
Leatham & Pincus discuss the foundation and the first steps in learning how to shoot rapidly. That first step is keeping your arms and upper body rigid while shooting rapidly. According to Leatham & Pincus the foundation of fast shooting has nothing to do with the slow easy trigger pull commonly taught by many gun schools.
But it has everything to do with pulling the trigger quickly and controlling that recoil. We do this by maintaining that strong structure when holding the pistol. There is no need to be meticulous with the trigger pull and looking concentrating on the front sights.
Theres a time and place for everything that you learn in marksmanship. The slow trigger squeeze to be accurate and the quick trigger pull when you’re under real life threatening situation. Practice both.
Pincus: Wow that looks really good. Every time I teach somebody how to shoot quickly, you already know how to do this, but they don’t, I wanna show them what the fundamental starting point is- what I call the foundation- for being able to shoot fast. Go ahead and unload, I need you empty. Most people’s dry-fire drill is a ball-and-dummy drill (clear) is a ball and- (stay striker-back though) So aim at the target, Rob, what i always teach ’em to do is listen, you have to hold the gun in a manner that I don’t move you. So this is pretty good right there. Any time I wanna move the gun, I want their body to move, not wrist. Wrist and joints, that’s bad, shouldn’t bend. Now the next part of it is, we teach people, ‘focus on the front sights, squeeze the trigger’, but in a real shooting environment, you realize you don’t have time to play that game. So you have to learn to pull that trigger. I can look at the target and tell you Rob can do this right. Finger on the trigger, when I say ‘now’, dryfire. Standby, ready, now! [Click] Standby, ready, now! [Click] Standby, ready, Now [Click] Ready, now [Click] So what you’ll notice on someone when they’re learning is that almost always we have that stupid jerk that controls recoil, right? So if people would quit trying to control recoil, and learn how to pull the trigger quickly, then the recoil wouldn’t become a factor. Let me explain why.
So you’re aimed in on the target, you’re ready to go. You’ve decided to shoot -remember, all the work’s done now.
Pincus: At this point, I don’t even care where your focal distance is, target, sights, as long as you see a good enough representation. Finger on the trigger, ready to fire, pull the trigger. Now! [Click] So the trick is to be able to pull the trigger rapidly. Now at any point did you see the sight move off the target?
Pincus: Now! [click] Did it ever move off of the part?
Pincus: So we don’t need any better trigger pull than that. But we think we need this fine-tuned- ‘touch the trigger, we need you to squeeeze it real careful-like, like this. [click]’ -Look how long that takes! It takes me three seconds -put your finger on- if I told you to just ‘squeeze the trigger’ I’ll start now. [Click] That’s a second! Do you know what happens in a second?!
Pincus: In the competition world, I lose the match. That one second cost me the whole match. In a real environment? Something way worse happens in a second. You realize even a big guy like me, what’s the distance, I can move seven yards in a second?
Rob: Absolutely. Yeah, you know, this to me is so important, right? Now I know my fundamentals could stand to improve dramatically-
Pincus: Naw your fundamentals are good.
Rob: You’re one of the best coaches in the world, that’s what you do, I know you do it really well, but I think it’s important that people hear that the best coach in the world, when it comes to competition shooting, if he’s telling you to do that three-second trigger press in the environment of defensive shooting, probably something’s wrong.
Pincus: It can’t work! It can’t work. The whole thing- you know what’s gonna happen in three seconds? You’re not gonna be involved in the game. It’s gonna be all over and you’re gonna be a loser.
Rob: So, good enough, not perfect.
Rob: That’s the foundation of fast shooting.
Pincus: That’s it.
Tom McHale of Springfield Armory questioned Rob Leatham about stances while shooting.
Many novices are confused with the stances that are taught such as: Isoceles, Weaver, Chapman and your own. What Rob explains and demonstrates has nothing to do with the stance that you use.
What really matters are:
The main thing to really understand and practice is your balance while shooting on rapidly. Rob explains there should be a slight forward lean while shooting, how much depends on what caliber you’re throwing down range.
Other key points are – your hands and arms need to be rigid and your body position has to be balance so that it can’t be pushed off center. Apply all of this while shooting. This is achieved (with a little practice) while leaning slightly forward while shooting.
Sources: Tom McHale, Rob Leatham, Andy van Loan, Springfield Armory Youtube
Anyone that follows Rob Leatham, who is known for his pistol shooting prowess knows about his “the Walk Back Challenge” drill.
Basically the drill starts at the 50 yard take a shot with your pistol, if you hit the full size steel target. Proceed to the 100 yard, you keep repeating this drill until you’ve reached a distance where you miss the target. Normally this is around the 200 to 250 yard range.
In this demonstration Larry Vicker using a Glock 20 which shoots a 10mm, the power is between a .357 and 41 Magnum. This pistol is ideal not only for home and self defense. But, it may be a perfect fit for hunters and back packers as well. Consider having 2 magazines which houses 15 rounds each, thats a total of 30 magnum power at your disposal. With the flatter trajectory of the 10mm rounds theres a good chance you can reach out and touch something if needed.
Check out the footage below and whats the farthest that you’ve shot with a pistol?
Source: Vickers Tactical, TacTV
There are many gun enthusiasts out there that are on different platforms. One of the big question is, “Is the most important thing speed, or is it accuracy?” In this post Rob Leatham and Rob Pincus will discuss and answer this.
The main thing is finding that happy balance that you shoot fast enough without being too slow and be accurate. Both Rob will walk you through some timing drills to build your skills up to where you need to be.
No Secret or Trick
After several rounds of this timing drill, neither Rob’s was faster than the other in reaction time. Both fired with the same speed on target. At the conclusion both Rob’s confirmed that “It’s about pulling the trigger instantaneously without moving“. Does that mean you don’t learn the basic fundamentals, obviously you still do then you progress to faster trigger pull. Both Rob also confirms that most people don’t progress further due to instructors not passing on further skills development.
[RobL] Hi, Rob Leatham with Springfield Armory, we’re here at Cowtown USA shooting facility outside of Phoenix Arizona, and I’m here with Glen from Independance Training.
[Glen] Rob, you know we get a lot of different shooters out here at the range from all different types of skill levels, and regardless of the type of platform that they’re running, whether it’s rifle or carbine or handgun, they all have the same question: Is the most important thing speed, or is it accuracy?
[RobL] That’s the eternal question right there. How fast do I have to go before I start missing, and how much slower do I have to go to be more accurate? The real truth is, you can never go as fast as you want, because you’ll start missing, and you can’t be as accurate as you’d like to be, because it’d be too slow, so it’s all finding that balance. There’s lots of ways to determine how fast you should go, but the skill-building portion of it is really what interests me. I’m gonna run you through a couple drills here, so–
[RobL] Go ahead and– what you’re gonna do is, start off with timing me.
[RobL] Fundamentally, I want you to give me a standby ready that’s on an instant, and push the button, and I’m gonna fire a shot.
[RobL] Whenever you’re ready.
[Glen] Alright. Shooter ready?
[RobL] So what’s that time?
[Glen] Point two-five!
[RobL] So in one quarter of a second, I’m able to respond to an audible, and shoot a target dead center.
[RobL] Now if you wanna go faster, you can, but there’s tricks to doing it, and it almost always costs you something. So give me a couple more of those.
[Glen] Alright. Shooter ready!
[RobL] So what’s that time?
[Glen] Point one-nine.
[RobL] Ok so that’s starting with finger off the trigger, which I consider the ready position. I teack ready position- contact point is the gross trigger-pull from the start of contact to the wall. So that was all the way out, do me again.
[Glen] Alright. Shooter ready.
[RobL] What’s that?
[Glen] Point one-four.
[RobL] Okay, give me one more.
[Glen] Shooter ready. Standby.
[RobL] What’s that?
[Glen] Point one-six.
[RobL] Ok, so in under two-tenths of a second, I’m able to pull the trigger off an audible and hit the target pretty much dead-center. Let’s give you a shot at this thing.
[RobL] So you can start with your finger anywhere you want, you’re aimed-in ready to go, and as soon as you get the buzzer, gimmee a shot.
[RobL] Are you ready? Standby!
[RobL] Excellent, nineteen! Do it again. Standby. Ready?
[RobL] Point two-two, give me a little faster. Standby, ready?
[RobL] Point one-five, so you’re just as fast as I am. One of the things that I get all the time, is that students always think there’s some magic in the reaction time, that maybe I have a better reaction time than you. I don’t. I’ve tested myself a zillion times, I’m just the same. What I’ve learned how to do is pull the trigger REALLY fast without moving, and it’s not a trick. But you obviously have learned how to pull the trigger fast. There’s a lot of silly stuff going around out there, people think you can only shoot accurately if you pull very very slowly, but that’s only really important when the precision becomes very very high. So let’s increase the required accuracy a little bit.
[RobL] Step on up, I need you to hit the box in the center, in the A-zone.
[Glen] A-zone! Head?
[RobL] A-zone in the head.
[RobL] Start on the target, ready to rock.
[Glen] Alright. Finger on the trigger?
[RobL] Yep. ready to go. You’re– the decision to shoot has been made, you’re waiting for the go.
[RobL] Standby, ready?
[RobL] Ok, so time is point-one-six. Did you get the quality shot you needed?
[Glen] I did.
[RobL] so why would you ever pull the trigger slowly? Alright? Was there a low? Was there a high? It was pretty much a good shot. Alright, do it again. Standby, ready? [BeePOP] Point one-nine. So you’re right on, bullets are touching each-other, you’re shooting as quickly as you can fire the gun, because you’ve learned a fundamental technique that a lot of people don’t know. You know what that is?
[Glen] What’s that?
[RobL] Jerking the trigger without moving the gun. And a lot of people think that this whole thing is about squeezing the trigger, and it’s not. It’s about pulling the trigger instantaneously without moving. Now you realize, if he can hit the middle of that head at four yards like that, that would hit the whole target at fifty yards. What happens is the process changes, and the person thinks because the shot gets more difficult that he has to change the process. You don’t. You just have to do it right.
[Glen] And do you think that’s an error in the way that people are taught the fundamentals, or the way they’re teaching themselves, or the way they’re learning the fundamentals?
[RobL] No… I don’t think it has a lot to do with the fundamentals, I think it has to do with us as instructors, as we’ve not kept up with the needs of our students. The first guy you get, you’re not gonna teach him how to do this.
[Glen] No, absolutely not.
[RobL] ‘Cuz there’s no way you can do it. There’s no way he can even understand the concepts of pulling the trigger that quickly. He’s almost every time gonna jerk the gun out of alignment when he does it. So that guy, you’re gonna say ‘listen, line the sights up, learn to pull the trigger without moving the gun. If you need to do it slowly, do it slowly. But then as you become better at moving your trigger finger, to the exclosion of moving anything else in your hand’, then we should keep up and now what we say is ‘Ok, pull the trugger faster’ and faster, and faster, and faster, and faster. Because the trick is always, once you wanna shoot fast, we start taking things that should happen in sequence, and doing them all at once.
Sights are on the target, you say fire the gun, you know when you fire the gun, the gun’s gonna kick, so as you fire the gun, you’re also controlling the recoil that’s coming from firing the shot, and it moves it down.
[Glen] Now at what point does a shooter move from that ‘perfect sight alignment, good solid sooth compression’, to what we’re doing here?
[RobL] I always push a student to the point of failure. The practice range is the place to screw up. So let’s say– I’ll give you a perfect example. Run me again, and I’ll show you the jerk, ok?
[RobL] We good there?
[Glen] Shooter ready. Standby.
[RobL] So what’s the time?
[Glen] You are point-two-one.
[RobL] See the shot down on the bottom?
[Glen] All the way down there.
[RobL] So the normal way of dealing with that would be, come back to the student, say ‘Listen, you need to slow down’. But what I did was nothing to do with the speed that I did it. It’s the fact that I moved the gun out of alignment when I fired the shot. So unfortunately, what will come back to them from the instructor’s standpoint, is ‘Oh we need you to slow down, you’re not ready to pull the trigger that fast’. It had nothing to do with pulling the trigger. To get the gun pointed down there, I had to do something, right? I had to move the gun out of alignment. So then we take the student and say ‘Listen, quit worrying so much about aiming, worry about pulling the trigger and moving nothing else’.
by J Hines
Source: IndependenceTraining Youtube, Rob Leatham, Rob Pincus
That’s right coming from Rob Leatham. When it comes to shooting, few are at Rob Leatham’s caliber so when he’s got something to say about shooting, we should pay attention. Or, shouldn’t we? Without questioning Rob’s shooting ability, there has been debates on the different school of thoughts when it comes to “instinctive” shooting to precise shooting, or, accuracy shooting to speed shooting. As you can see the list goes on, we have written one piece when the NYPD shooting program came under fire when their officers were missing their shots in actual incidents, when lives counted.
Which ever side of the fence you stand on, Rob’s statement is sure to perk your interest and opinion on shooting, here’s 3 things that Rob talks about to make you a better shooter.
Take a look at the video.
Here’s what they’re all saying about Rob’s shooting method.
What do you all think?, feel free to comment below.
[Rob Leatham] An instructor comes in, and the first thing they tell you is, “Focus on the sights, squeeze the trigger, pin the trigger to the rear, ONLY release the trigger, and try to relax. It’s all Bull[BLEEP]. As a rule, the first thing you should learn is to pull the trigger without moving the gun. You don’t even need to load the gun, you don’t need a target. You need to be able to fire the gun without altering the attitude, and the direction the gun’s pointed. Until you can do that, aiming is meaningless. Think about it, if you’re shooting a shot, you’re focused on that front sight, you’re looking at that front sight, You’re lookin’, lookin’, lookin’, you say “I’m gonna shoot…NOW.” And you jerk the gun six inches low, eight inches low, it didn’t matter if you aimed to begin with! So it’s pointless to focus on aiming until fire control is in place.
Ok, so the first thing I teach a new shooter is always the same thing: First off it’s safety, keep the gun pointed the right way, all that kinda crap. At that point, we turn into ‘Now listen, what I need you to do is hold the gun firmly’ and I put their hands on the gun, I show ’em how I want ’em to grip it, I don’t even need ’em to bring it up to eye level. I tell ’em ‘hold the gun right there, cycle gun, now pull the trigger’. Click. Nothin’, move. Click, nothin’ moves. Click, nothin’ moves. ‘Cuz they’re not aiming, so they don’t care about aiming. So you’re not letting the process of aiming affect their shooting as they’re pulling the trigger.
Then it’s “Ok, now extend the gun, point the gun at the target, don’t care about the sights yet, and pull the trigger. Click. Click, click.” So now we’re gonna shoot some shots, and I don’t care where you hit, we’re gonna shoot some shots now, live fire. And almost immediately, guy will start shooting, and I’ll see him aim, aim, aim, and I’ll say “Stop. You’re aiming. I don’t need you aiming, you’re gonna hit the target at three or four or five yards without aiming, so don’t worry about it. You can’t miss from lack of aiming at that distance. You’ll miss by moving the gun out of alignment by jerking, flinching, pushing, pulling. And it’s not ‘jerking the trigger’ either, I hate it when people blame everything on not seeing the ffff– the sight. And jerking the trigger. To shoot fast you’re gonna jerk the trigger, so learn how to jerk the trigger without moving the gun! It’s that simple! It’s just not easy to do.
So fundamentally if you’re trying to teach somebody that; this is one of Springfield’s new OSPs, the gun I shot at the Nationals; so the guy that does this motion right here, sights, everything looks good, and then they say ‘I’m gonna shoot NOW’, It won’t matter if te dot was where I wanted it or not. Because I moved it eight or ten or twelve inches when I moved it. So what I need the guy to do is forget about aiming, point the gun out at the target, and do this. Learn how to do this motion right here. Ok? So now even though I’m poorly aimed, the shot’s going to go where it was directed. And NOW aiming will matter.
So this is what it looks like live-fire. So you put it on here, you do everything right, you put the dot on the target, and you pull the trigger. Pull the trigger, pull the trigger, pull the trigger. Ok? At that point, I’m not trying to see a perfect clear dot. In this case, it’s a dot, not ironsights. I’m not trying to make the dot motionless.
I’m not trying to fixate all my conscious thought on that aiming point. It’s about thirty percent on the visual, and the rest of it is all on feeling the trigger. ‘Cuz if I can move the trigger without moving the gun, I’m gonna have a good shot.
Now, shooting’s really simple, guys. It’s not necessarily easy, but there’s only three things that you have to do.
Hold the gun really tight, okay, don’t try to relax, hold the gun tight.
Point the gun at the target where you want to hit it.
And pull the trigger as fast as you can without moving.
That’s it. That’s all the secrets to shooting. And if you do it right, while it’s not necessarily easy, it is very simple.
I’m holding the gun as tight as I can, locking the gun, the sight’s in the target, pull the trigger, pull the trigger, pull the trigger, like that. Ok? And I just keep pulling the trigger.
Now you come look at the target.
[Cameraman] You’re fairly confident that this is gonna look like it’s supposed to?
[Rob] Well, I mean, it’s gonna be– the dot moved about this much when I was shooting. So if you look at the target, where are the shots gonna be? In that area. Now I could shoot it faster, and I could also shoot it more accurately, but the first thing isn’t learning this precision slow-fire crap. The hardest thing to do is to take somebody, who you forced them to focus on slow-fire and precision, and say ‘now just do it fast’. Because you don’t do the same things for precision that you do– The concept is, and it’s fault, it’s false– is that you do the same thing shooting faster that you do shooting accurately. It’s not true. The process of pulling the trigger is different when you’re shooting fast than when you’re shooting accurately. Now, can I pull the trigger slow? Yeah, ‘course I can. But the process is based on the ability to hold the gun, so the most important part is not aiming, it is pulling the trigger without moving the gun, it has little to do with the trigger, it has more to do with gripping and how you hold the gun and how motionless you can make the gun.
Alright, so I’m Rob Leatham from Springfield Armory, and thanks for watching Funker Tactical.
by J Hines
Source: Funker Tactical Youtube, Rob Leatham